Wes Pfiffner

Shedding Light on the Benefits of Red Light Therapy with Wes Pfiffner - episode 247

How often do we stop to consider the impact of light on our wellbeing? The Art of Living Proactively podcast recently explored the intriguing world of red light therapy with Wes Pfiffner, an expert from Joovv, and the insights shared were nothing short of illuminating. Join us as we delve into the power of light and its profound effects on our health and vitality.

The Power of Choice:

In this riveting episode, Wes Pfiffner advocates for a proactive approach to health and self-discovery. He emphasizes the significance of making informed choices, particularly when it comes to harnessing the benefits of red light therapy. From the selection of products to understanding the science behind light and its impact on our bodies, the episode serves as a catalyst for empowering individuals to take charge of their health and explore what works best for them.

Action Steps and Call to Action:

Armed with the knowledge shared in this episode, listeners are encouraged to take proactive steps in their wellness journey. Whether it’s exploring the potential benefits of red light therapy, diving into literature on circadian rhythms and posture, or simply making more informed choices about their health, embracing a proactive mindset can be truly transformative. The call to action is clear – embrace the power of choice and embark on a journey towards holistic wellbeing.

Chapters:

02:06 What Wes thinks about being proactive
04:22 What is red light therapy?
06:41 Science behind red light
07:48 Difference between rel light therapy and red light saunas
11:34 How long would you use it for?
12:37 How red lights effects inflammation
14:29 Chronic inflammation
16:10 What is the difference between all the red light panals?
18:26 What potential dangers are there?
21:04 Tell me more about increasing nitric oxide
23:21 Is there a recommended amount of time per week?
25:17 Does time of day matter?
27:12 Would it work well with meditation?
28:53 Hormesis
30:18 Myths about red light therapy
33:21 Fave books

As we draw the curtains on this enlightening episode, we are reminded of the transformative potential that lies within our choices. The power of light, when harnessed correctly, can be a driving force in our pursuit of holistic health. Armed with newfound knowledge and a proactive mindset, we can chart a course towards a more vibrant, energised, and resilient way of living. The Art of Living Proactively awaits those who dare to embrace the power of their choices.

Guest Bio:

Wes Pfiffner is a member of Joovvs leadership team, and leads all their marketing efforts. Wes has a background in marketing and is a complete nerd when it comes to all things health and fitness related.

Watch this episode on YouTube

Transcript

247 – Wes Pfiffner

Can light lead you to a lighter, brighter, more energized life. Stay tuned to find out.

This is Tony Winyard welcoming you to an illuminating episode. guaranteed to shine a light on improving your health and wellbeing. My very special guest today is Wes Pfiffner, an expert on harnessing the power of red and near infrared light. to give our bodies, an energizing boost. If you think light is only good for helping you see, think again. We’ll be delving into the science showing how red light therapy could be the missing link in your health and performance. Reducing inflammation accelerating recovery, stimulating mitochondria and more Wes will help cut through the fuzzy misconceptions Around red light and ensure you avoid any dodgy products You’ll also get practical tips on soaking up more natural sunlight and creating healthy habits at home i’m sure you’ll be dazzled And motivated to take control of light for whole body benefits Get ready to flip the switch on feeling lighter and brighter. Please do leave your enlightened comments on youtube after tuning in. Now let’s shine a light on living proactively.

[00:01:25] Tony Winyard: Welcome to The Art of Living Proactively. My guest today, Wess Ner. How you doing Wes?

[00:01:30] Wes Pfiffner: Good Tony, how are you?

[00:01:31] Tony Winyard: I’m doing well. And we’re California today.

[00:01:34] Wes Pfiffner: That’s right. That’s right. Sunny California.

[00:01:36] Tony Winyard: California love. Good to see So Wes works for a company called Joovv and they do red light therapy. Now, I know that there’s gonna be a lot of people listening.

Probably you have no idea what red light therapy is. And equally, maybe a number of people . Who they’ve heard of it, but they’re not really sure. So we are gonna dig in to find out, we’re gonna find out a lot more about what it is, and clear up all the sort of myths and so on. But let’s start off with what are your thoughts around being proactive?

[00:02:06] What Wes thinks about being proactive

[00:02:06] Wes Pfiffner: I think when I think of being proactive, I think of a lot of things of like self discovery and when we get into this topic of health, since the launch of social media, . the last decade or two we’ve really seen a lot of people gravitating towards, influencers and seeing people like what are they mixing into their routine, what works and some people being so definitive on this is the answer to health. And health’s very fluid, it’s always moving.

And so what I, how I look at health is really like self-discovery and the more things you can implement and try. The more times you’ll fail, but the more times you’ll find answers. And so I think that’s one of the best ways to be proactive with your health is try different things. Don’t stay in a rutt.

If it’s not working for you, change it. don’t keep, going on. If something’s not working, change it. Change up your routine, change up your diet. See what works for you. But ultimately. It’s about self-discovery and what works best for you. Because, and a lot of times, Tony, how you live your life and how you do your daily routine, that may not work for me.

And now we know there’s science to that, right? Some people have different circadian rhythms where they’re more awake in the morning, right? As soon as they’re out of bed, they’re ready to go. They’re, their brain is alert, like they’re ready to chomp at the bit for the day. Some people, they don’t hit that till two in the afternoon.

One in the afternoon, right? Those are more your night owls. We used to look at those people as being really lazy. They just, they don’t get enough sleep. But if you paid attention to new science that’s coming out about circadian rhythm and specifically, sleep, some people are wired to where their brain doesn’t turn on until the afternoon, And going into what works best for you and me, like there’s a lot of people that’ll say, you gotta start at 5:00 AM in the morning and do this and that. No, I’m not a believer in that. I’m a believer in . Find out what works best for you, try different things, fail and learn from it.

And I think that’s the best way You’re gonna figure out how you as a person, your body responds and how, and how you can,really thrive, in the world and for your health. So that’s how I look at being proactive is really a lot of self-discovery.

[00:04:11] Tony Winyard: Yeah, I agree completely with everything you’ve just said.

and I’m wondering, as you were speaking, how does Red Light therapy fit into to being proactive? What, well maybe explain first what it is,

[00:04:22] What is red light therapy?

[00:04:22] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah. Yeah. It’s, I’ll be the first one. If you’re listening to this for the first time and you’re hearing about red light therapy or light therapy, most likely you’ve seen it. Online,or somewhat. But, I was a super big skeptic when I first saw Red light therapy. I was like, I’ve never seen anybody talk about this before.

And this was back in, oh geez. Before the company had been started. So 2015. So nobody was talking about red light. It, the only place you would’ve seen red light would’ve been like esthetician offices. skincare stuff. there’s been a lot of science behind skincare with red light therapy.

so you would’ve seen it in that regard, maybe a face mask, but still, like most people’s knowledge of light, very little. Most people looked at it as just something that can help you see. but when, when you when you break down light, it’s energy. And most of us growing up, how we learned about light is it just helps us see.

Right? But when you actually start to look at light from a scientific perspective, it’s energy and the sun, which is our primary source. Of light and really in this universe that we live in, light is powering everything. it gives the earth heat, it, the plants and all and everything.

respond to those wavelengths of light that hit the earth and grow, provides energy. And us as humans, we really aren’t any different. a lot of people know the benefits of the sun from a vitamin D perspective, but the sun is full spectrum and it’s giving off thousands of different wavelengths.

And one of those just happens to be red and near infrared. And what those wavelengths have been shown,to do through countless, clinical studies is it actually helps, our cells function properly. And so it, it helps them produce more energy, known as ATP. And so it stimulates, an organelle in the cell called, mitochondria, which is, which helps produce, energy for the body.

And in, in a . and to button that up is red and near infrared light is specific wavelengths that your body can absorb that allows the cells to function at, at their peak and produce energy. the body can thrive. And that’s just really our makeup.

When you look at a lot of things of how we get sick, when we’re not doing well, our cells are typically struggling. and so red light therapy is a way to help support healthy cellular function.

[00:06:31] Tony Winyard: So on a bright sunny day, if someone’s, I don’t know, lying on a beach, for example, on a bright sunny day, how much red light would they be taking in, for example?

Yeah.

[00:06:41] Science behind red light

[00:06:41] Wes Pfiffner: Well, that, that’s a tough question because the sun goes through seasons, right? As the earth rotates, we get further away from the sun. And so that’s why we experienced different seasons, right? We got summer, fall, winter, spring, and during the . during the fall and winter, the sun’s further away, right?

It’s still gonna be a sunny day, it can be a sunny day in, in the fall, but the sun’s impact is much less. that’s ’cause the earth is further away. and so it’s a tough question to ask specifically, like what the time of day, ’cause there’s, there can be clouds, et cetera, but. typically at peak day, that’s when the sun’s gonna be at, its at its strongest.

And if you’ve noticed most people have during a sunrise and sunset, what colors are primarily, active from the sun? It’s red and near infrared. I. And because red is the longest color visible wavelength, that’s the only thing that’s making it through the atmosphere. That’s why you typically see like a red orangey tint or every sunrise and sunset because those other wavelengths are not reaching the surface of the earth.

[00:07:40] Tony Winyard: ’cause as well as red light therapy. Something else that many people have been talking about the last couple of years is red light saunas and so on, and, but they’re not the same thing, are they?

[00:07:48] Difference between rel light therapy and red light saunas

[00:07:48] Wes Pfiffner: no, they’re not. And they’re actually quite different. So you will see, some people will incorporate in saunas red light, like lighting above them, like a fixture. And that’s really more light to help with mood, different colors to help with mood. but saunas and a lot of people know ’em, there’s different types of saunas, but the one you’re referring to is like an infrared sauna.

Is that the same thing as red light? And they’re actually very different. When you look at infrared specifically there, there’s three types. There’s near, mid, and far and near infrared is what you typically see in, in red light panels, or red light beds, . It’s a shorter wavelength. It’s just after,red light therapy when you’re looking at the light spectrum.

And then you got mid and far infrared is a much longer wavelength and it’s got a lot of heat to it. And so what happens is those wavelengths, in a sauna far infrared, they get, they, your body absorbs them and it’s primarily affecting the water in your tissues. And so it’s almost like cooking.

You. from the inside out. So it’s designed to generate heat. And far infrared saunas actually heat your body. So you activate heat shock proteins, you start to, you start to sweat detox. Lots of benefits for far infrared. But when you’re looking at it as how are they different far, infrared provides heat and stress on the body.

And then near infrared is a minor little stress that you typically won’t even feel. and it’s generating energy. So you got red and near infrared light therapy providing energy, and then a far infrared sauna. it’s putting stress on the body to help detox, so we actually recommend a lot of people use both the therapies together and,by doing a sauna session first and then following up with a red light therapy session after, because your body’s going through a workout in a sauna.

it’s putting a lot of stress on if anybody’s actually done a good sauna session, whether it’s a . a dry sauna, a wet sauna, or far infrared sauna, you feel, you feel good after, but your body definitely went through a workout, right? And ’cause it’s try, it’s fighting to keep its core temperature stable.

That’s why you’re sweating, et cetera. so they’re great therapies to use in conjunction with one another, doing a sauna. And then we like to use, use Joovv red light therapy after.

[00:10:01] Tony Winyard: So people are probably wondering, well, how would you use that Joovv? I mean, and what is it that you would do?

Are you holding something or how does it work?

[00:10:09] Wes Pfiffner: another great question. So we, when we looked at first creating Joovv, there was a lot of, targeted devices out there. And so what I mean by targeted is people were wearing face masks, they had more handheld stuff, whether you could, to treat different areas around your body.

And when you look at the clinical data, there is a tremendous amount and for various areas around your body for treating skin. issues for,treating, joint pain and inflammation, treating wounds. now you’re seeing stuff for eyes. You’re seeing stuff for hair. You’re seeing stuff for muscle recovery.

it’s just all around the body. They’re showing where, when, where. You shine this light on the body, those cells respond really well. and so we looked at that and thought, well, no one’s really, no one’s really providing solutions to treat your entire body. And so that’s really the, the start of where Joovv developed these panels.

And so there we have red light panels that you can put in your home that can treat. sections of your body or if you’re gonna create a bigger setup can treat your entire body. and you would stand at a distance, 12 to or 16 to 24 inches away, and just expose as much skin as you can and let your body absorb that light energy.

And so that’s what kind of separated you. We were the first company to launch this panel concept. and from there it’s really taken off and a lot of people are benefiting from. Putting this healthy light, in their home and having access to it, on, on a daily basis.

[00:11:34] How long would you use it for?

[00:11:34] Tony Winyard: And so how long would you just sit in front of it or how, I mean, how long would you do that?

[00:11:40] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah. So treatments are typically 10, 10 to 20 minutes per treatment area. So let’s say I’m in front of a device that’s,we have a modular system and so you can, you can buy one panel, you, or you can connect them to another panel and . Ideally treat your entire body and,it’s 10 to 20 minutes per treatment or so you just need to expose, si similar.

How I’m sure most folks have experienced a tanning bed, right? You’d go into a tanning bed, set the timer, and just expose your skin and relax. and your body actually absorbs this light and it penetrates fairly deep into the body, especially near infrared. and that’s where you’ll see the differences of red and near infrared.

Red light is primarily absorbed by the outer tissues like your skin, and then near infrared, penetrates a little deeper and can actually stimulate, muscles, can provide healing on, on, on a deeper level. So both wavelengths are very good in conjunction with one another. And so that’s typically how a treatment is just exposing your skin and letting, letting your body absorb the light.

[00:12:37] How red lights effects inflammation

[00:12:37] Tony Winyard: So when you say, for example, it helps with inflammation, so inflammation’s quite important for the body, isn’t it?

We don’t necessarily want to stop inflammation happening. So how does it help inflammation?

[00:12:48] Wes Pfiffner: I think Tony, that’s a such a critical question because . You see that a lot, and we actually have a great article on our site that’s called Less Ice, more Light. And in fact, most people are starting to pull it back as far as the inflammation out there of using ice. and a big thing there is what does ice do?

Ice cuts off blood flow. And so when it cuts off blood flow,your body’s not able to really form that bubble. Around that injury and, because that’s essentially what an inflammation is. It’s like a, it’s like an internal bandaid. and when you cut off the blood flow, you can reduce the inflammation.

But does that accelerate the recovery because you actually want that brief acute response of a, of inflammation. and what, so what red light therapy does is part of the mechanism of action is there’s a brief . uptake in nitric oxide, released into the bloodstream. So you actually see an increase in blood flow.

So what it happens is it, so your question, does it, Inflammation, right? Is it stopping it or is it just accelerating? And it’s really just accelerating that process naturally, right? It’s getting more blood flow there more,more of, the blood, like the white blood cells, et cetera, that, that repair damaged tissues.

It’s getting more of that there. And it’s also helping those cells that are under oxidated stress in that area. let’s say an example. I went and did like a, a leg workout and I did a bunch of squats. I did a bunch of lunges. My legs are shot, right? They’re gonna, you’re gonna fill up with lactic acid, they’re gonna fill up with brief acute inflammation, red and near infrared, helps that recover just faster by healing those cells and giving those cells, shifting them from oxidative stress back to homeostasis.

And then you see a brief uptick in, in ATP. and so it just accelerates that pro na, that natural process faster.

[00:14:29] Chronic inflammation

[00:14:29] Tony Winyard: Right. And so what about then if someone has say chronic inflammation?

[00:14:36] Wes Pfiffner: That’s a good question. that’s a good question. There’s a very good meta-analysis on, the different mechanisms of red and near infrared four for inflammation. So it’s probably that’s a tough question to answer because the body is so complex and there’s many different issues of maybe why somebody’s dealing with

With chronic inflammation, right? is it arthritis? is it,is it, is it fibromyalgia? what are, is it their, is it diet related? is it some sort of a supplement they’re taking? is it a living environment, right? is it mold or is it, who knows?

what is causing that? So it’s always tough to say what it could do for chronic, but if you look at what just light does in general, it’s providing your cells, . With energy to function A as they’re designed to. So anytime you can support healthy cellular function, you’re giving your body the tools.

just like you would want to take vitamins or eat a good, healthy diet, you’re giving your body the tools. For it to run, as it wants to run. And anytime you can set yourself up for that, like what, like we’re talking about being proactive, you’re gonna, you’re gonna build a stronger body,that’s better prepared to take on, the stresses of the day or, or maybe it, maybe you’re supporting like you’re sick with something.

Or, just if I was to roll an ankle, like I’m gonna, I’m gonna deliver light to that, damaged area to give my body the tools to help prepare itself.

[00:15:52] Tony Winyard: And so as far as the actual panels, I mean you, you mentioned it’s modular and so on, and there seems to be quite a few different companies selling or, they’ve got various types of red light therapy, panels.

I guess is there much difference between ’em? I know there’s lots of stuff coming outta China, for example.

[00:16:10] What is the difference between all the red light panals?

[00:16:10] Wes Pfiffner: yeah. There is that, that really goes into any type when you see a successful . product category be developed. You always see a lot of fast followers and a lot, you’ll, you’ll see a lot of, let’s say, janky products on Amazon, right? Just it goes with the industry. I mean, if you, if anybody can remember when massage guns came onto the market, like now there’s probably a thousand of ’em on Amazon, right?

And so one, we’re the original creators of the Red Light panel per se. and so we work with a lot of individuals in the research space. and we’ve really designed our products to give the body, a safe dosage of light. You see a lot of products out there saying, oh, we deliver more power.

We’re this really, there’s no validation for that, especially with, you’ll see companies delivering multiple different wavelengths of red light, but your body responds the same to any different type of red wavelength. It’s so close that it’s not really making a significant difference.

So you see a lot of smoke and mirrors. In the red light industry with companies trying to pull a leg up. And the other part is, what separates Joovv is we actually design and develop our own products. most of what you’ll see on the market is just white labeled . products, like you mentioned, China.

they really don’t, they really don’t own those products or haven’t, designed them. They don’t really know what’s in those products. when you’re creating a product, especially here in the States, you have to follow fairly strict guidelines because it is a class two medical device. And differences with our product is the quality components are just a higher standard.

we’ve actually gone through independent safety testing, to make sure it’s safe and effective for folks at home. And so the components are just that much on a higher level. and we’re delivering a safe dosage. you wouldn’t want to just expose your body to anything out there, especially naked, not knowing if it’s been safety tested, different things like that.

So we take a lot of pride in really creating. A safe, effective device and creating and designing our own products and not just simply buying something off, Alibaba as an example because you just see that now nowadays, folks just, and some countries especially, you mentioned China, that kind of flood the market with copycat devices.

and so we do everything. We, we do everything the right way and really try to create a great product for consumers that, that can really, affect their health in a positive way.

[00:18:26] What potential dangers are there?

[00:18:26] Tony Winyard: So what could be a potential danger of someone buying, a product from somewhere? they’ve, there’s no, the manufacturer isn’t established.

Some what could be a possible danger from using a product like that?

[00:18:38] Wes Pfiffner: well, there could be many things. One, it, I mean, it could shock them. If it’s not, it, how safe it is. Has it been tested to, to go through all of that stuff. another one could be,maybe you’re delivering way too high of power to your body,in the, the photo medicines,research, there’s a known effect called the biphasic dosage response.

And it’s when you actually deliver too much light, too fast can actually cause damage to your cells. It’s almost like an overload. and so you want to make sure that dosages is safe and effective, but if you deliver too much light, for example, so there’s lots of products out there too that don’t deliver enough light.

So if you’ve ever seen something like a little flashlight, something like that’s not gonna do . Do the job. you need to make sure it’s delivering a high enough dosage to stimulate the cells, but, but not too high to where you’re gonna cause damage to the cells. So there, I mean, there’s many things, especially if you’re not like, with our products, we provide,eye protection.

our, we’ve gone through testing that are glasses. They do block that certain wavelength of light that there is a potential to, maybe overheat. the tissues in your eyes. And so there’s just many little nuances like that to where you know you’re gonna be exposing your body no different than your ti if you’re to take a supplement.

Like you’re exposing this to your body and radiating light on it. you want to make sure it’s just, it, it’s been safety tested.

[00:19:54] Tony Winyard: And so are there areas of the body you need to be more careful with then? It’s, I mean, obviously you just mentioned the eyes. Is there any other areas,

[00:20:01] Wes Pfiffner: not really. in fact, there’s been pretty cool research. we’ve participated in some small pilot studies. I. showing benefits for hormones. So like another sensitive area you would think like for a male is the testes or the private area. and actually there’s some science in animal models, but also we’ve seen it in some research we’ve participated in with an increase in testosterone.

it’s not anything that we can make like a, a strong claim about, but it just goes down to that mechanism of ranier infrared light stimulates healthy cellular function well. there’s mitochondria,in the testes, right? The late cells, there’s cells there that, that require energy, right?

To create. to create testosterone, different things of those functions. and when they receive energy, they can work properly. And so that’s what’s really fascinating about it is, what we’ve seen. There isn’t any sensitive areas. Now, if you’re delivering too high of a power down there, you , that may not be such a pleasant response.

but, but yeah, so that, that could potentially be something. But in general, . when you’re delivering a safe dosage, you can radiate the entire body.

[00:21:04] Tell me more about increasing nitric oxide

[00:21:04] Tony Winyard: And you mentioned about it increases nitric oxide. So that suggests to me, I guess it would be good for people with like asthma and respiratory issues.

[00:21:13] Wes Pfiffner: it could be. I mean, it’s, we’re always blown away with when somebody buys one of our products and they start using it, they may have bought it for X, but then all of a sudden they, they’ll leave a review or they’ll send an email and be like, Hey, I’m experiencing this type of a benefit.

is that normal? one of ’em, one of ’em, that I can think of that’s on the top of my head is . There was this gal who was doing a review of our product. I can’t remember what media outlet she wrote for, but, she has, I think it’s, where is it? Is it Bell’s Palsy where some of your face can go numb?

is that the right? I can’t remember. anybody that, that’s listening can fact check that. But there is a,an effect with, I think it’s a Bell’s Palsy that where half of your face can go, like numb. you just don’t, you don’t, you can’t feel anything.

And when she started using the red light, she was using it for skin benefits. Her Bells palsy cleared up 98% is what she, what she stated to us in an email. And she’s is that normal? Can that happen? And it’s I don’t, I mean, we don’t know, but like apparently that’s happening. And so that’s where the science is with red and ear and redline now.

It’s very fluid and it’s very evolving. most of what we’re able to say as far as a benefit is it, it can mildly reduce like pain and inflammation, relax, sore muscles, and then their skin health benefits. But it’s starting to evolve like way beyond that. and which is very exciting.

It’s a very exciting field to be in. and so we’re seeing that in the literature be proved out. There was, I know I mentioned the eyes, but there was a very exciting study. just a, just about a year and a half ago where they were using red light, not the near infrared light, red light. And it was actually help improving,vision for folks, 40 and, and over just a three minute treatment in the morning.

They were, they noted significant, benefits in improving their vision.

[00:22:49] Tony Winyard: vision

[00:22:50] Wes Pfiffner: And then one of ’em just to release this month. Very exciting study. folks that did a red light treatment after eating. it reduced blood glucose levels up to 28% versus, versus the placebo. and so that’s another one. We were scratching your head and you’re like, how could it do that?

But that kind of goes into the theme of what we’re talking about of how it just, your body takes that energy and it just starts functioning a as it’s designed to. Right. And so we don’t know the limits of it yet, which is very exciting.

[00:23:21] Is there a recommended amount of time per week?

[00:23:21] Tony Winyard: with a regular sauna. I mean, they say that if you can get accumulated 60 minutes a week, there’s like enormous benefit. So is it something similar you would need so many minutes per week, for example, or,

[00:23:34] Wes Pfiffner: great question. So typically we look at daily treatments. But most of the research that we’ve personally participated in, we saw jumps at six weeks, 12 weeks. So it’s something you need to be doing on a regular basis. It’s not a super immediate effect. Some people will see immediate, effects of maybe reducing pain in a joint because of that increase in blood flow, different things like that.

Or short-term muscle recovery. Hey, I feel a little bit less sore. After this. But I think some of those really long-term benefits, that really can improve the core of your health, it’s probably gonna be somewhere longer in, into the couple weeks. and and no different than when you’re introducing like a new supplement, maybe a multivitamin or maybe something you’re probably not gonna see.

The greatest, benefit the first time you take that supplement, but maybe when you’re looking at it over several weeks. but that’s not to say someone couldn’t see benefits right away, And because again, all of our bodies are different. Maybe we’re dealing with different stresses.

some people are super big into fitness, right? They put a lot of stress on their body. So implementing it right away like that, they could see a difference in their, in, in their recovery. So that’s something we see as an example with, a professional sports team that we’ve partnered with, the San Francisco 49 ERs.

So they’re an NFL team, right? And anybody that knows . American football, it’s a brutal sport, right? Those guys are running into each other like missiles and so they’re, it’s not uncommon for an NFL player to be like, after a game. They feel like they went through a car accident.

and so those like player, individuals like those who are putting a lot of stress on their body. they can see the benefits of it fairly quickly right after a game, and using it several days after a game, et cetera. So it depends on individual base. But from the research we’ve participated in, usually takes a couple weeks.

[00:25:17] Does time of day matter?

[00:25:17] Tony Winyard: And is there, have you noticed any difference whether. Is it better to, for example, to use it in the morning, afternoon, evening, or, I guess again, it depends on the person.

[00:25:29] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah, I mean, it depends on the person. Depends how they’re wired. we’ll, we’re split there from a customer base. Some customers, that’s part of their morning ritual, right? They get up. first thing they do is start, like a meditation routine, breathwork routine. It really helps wake them up.

It helps, give them some clarity energy throughout the day. and that’s one thing I personally do. I love to use it right in the morning. And, I’ve noticed firsthand, I. I know everyone can probably relate to this that time where you wake up some of those mornings and you just feel that brain fog.

It’s like you just woke up out of a deep sleep. Maybe suddenly maybe your alarm went off or something like that, and you just feel lethargic, right? for whatever reason, I, right after a treatment I do in the morning, that’s gone, like I just don’t experience that brain fog in the morning or that,that, that haziness that can be there.

and so a lot of people, like in the morning, me personally. but then there’s a large group that they like doing it at night. It really helps relax them. most likely shifts them into,like a parasympathetic state. And a lot of people will just rave about how they get great sleep,when they start using it at night before bed as a wind down tool, et cetera.

So it’s split there. And there’s also . A cool feature on our products that you can use through our app we call ambient mode. And it’s not delivering a, like a clinical dosage, it’s just delivering red ambient lighting. And so a lot of people will turn that setting on. ’cause at night, red is not very intrusive on your circadian rhythm, so it really doesn’t halt melatonin production.

and so it’s a great wind down tool to maybe put on in the bedroom, right? Maybe you’re gonna read a book or you’re gonna, you’re gonna do something as a wind down routine. Turn off all the blue light. it can be a great way to help and do sleep just from that ambient lighting perspective.

split there and really,depends on, what works best for you.

[00:27:12] Would it work well with meditation?

[00:27:12] Tony Winyard: And it sounds, well something that went through my mind as you were saying that it sounds like something that would be great to pair it together with say meditation, doing it at the same time as you meditate.

[00:27:23] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah. We see that a lot. We see a lot of people starting their day with that or their nighttime routine with that of breath work and meditation. Just, I think we live in such a world now that we’re so overstimulated. and if you think about us as humans right now, we’ve never had more information than any other humans on earth.

And we’ve never had it that fast. I mean, you can learn something with an instant and your brain can be constantly bouncing. I mean, how many of us, I’m sure . I’m gonna raise my hand. How many of us have, they maybe stumble across something, they’ve been scrolling and then they’re off learning about that, and then they’re clicking here, and then they’re doing, and it’s boom.

but think about your brain. It’s going, it’s like bouncing like boom. And that stimulation, right? And it can be very hard to turn that off and then go to bed. and so I think. When you’re, when we’re talking about something that can help relax you, calm you.

I think that’s a big thing in our day and age. you look at, you look at just the average, and this is the states, so I imagine it’s probably the same in the uk, but, a hundred years ago the average American slept about nine and a half hours. and now, we’re under six, the average American.

So that’s just significantly different in a hundred year span. We’re sleeping,over two hours less a night. and just that alone, like getting a good night’s sleep versus not getting a good night’s sleep. Like you’re not gonna, function the next day. yeah, I think, back to your question of it’s if IFD really good to pair it with things that can calm you, not stimulating, relaxing, so definitely great to pair with breath work or meditation.

[00:28:53] Hormesis

[00:28:53] Tony Winyard: Early on, you talked about how it. Stimulates production of mitochondria and ATP and everything.

And I wondered, something went through my mind as you were saying that does it, when you do hormesis and cold showers and saunas and so on, you are accumulating, you are building up more brown fat. Does this have anything to do with that whole sort of process?

[00:29:17] Wes Pfiffner: I, there you’ll see some folks promoting a lot of I know you’re not specifically talking about fat loss, but . There are some people that are promoting like high powered lasers of almost stimulating fat loss or burning fat loss, not really with our products.

You’re gonna, you’re gonna see that. Now, I will put a caveat in there that, and something we’ve seen through a research partner of ours and the study hasn’t been published yet, but, it helped assist. In, in, in someone, trying to, lose weight, with exercise and diet. Because if we, if you,if you go back to that study that I mentioned about blood glucose and how it lowered at 28%.

So if it has the ability to help your metabolic system, and that function better, it could help support, weight loss, different things. So it’s tough to put like a, an actual . yes or no on, on some of the stuff with like fat burning, et cetera. because it’s just so overall supporting with your body in nearly every function.

And that’s why we really encourage full body, to help try to get that systemic benefits.

[00:30:18] Myths about red light therapy

[00:30:18] Tony Winyard: are there any myths about red light therapy that you’d like to quash?

[00:30:24] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah, I’d say one of the bigger myths out there is it like, is it snake oil? and no,it’s definitely not. I mean, there’s a lot of scientific IT literature now. I mean, you can go to PubMed right now and just type in red light therapy, just type in the year 2023, you’re gonna see hundreds of studies.

it, it’s, so from that standpoint, like it’s really, it’s pretty solidified, that it, there is lots and lots of benefits to it. wavelengths do matter. the other thing I would probably say is it’s,you can’t get these benefits from, draping yourself in red Christmas lights.

It’s just, there’s not gonna be a high enough power, so power matters. and the science is legitimate when you’re looking at what this therapy can do for folks.

[00:31:04] Tony Winyard: And so when, if people are considering buying these products, I mean, obviously they should get Joovv products, but if they’re looking for things, what should they look out for?

What should they be looking to avoid?

[00:31:18] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah,I would avoid a couple things. I would really avoid,companies promoting,like when they promote, let’s say medical claims. ’cause a lot of companies, they’re trying to follow our route of being a legitimate medical product and simply stating it doesn’t mean you’re a medical product.

So I would always look at the company to show validation for that. So one, one tricky thing we’ve seen in the industry is folks saying, Hey, we’ve been through, safety testing and medical testing. But then when you ask, and they’ll show like a safety mark. But if you look up that safety mark, it’ll show it’s safe for horticulture use.

So like plant use, it’s a grow, like a grow light. So it’s very tricky. which is why we’re pretty transparent with all of that. we have,lots of articles on our website of things to really look out for and we, I believe it’s called, misleading Marketing Claims in the red light therapy industry.

And we call a lot of that out with power. Wavelengths, safety testing, misleading marks, all of that sort of stuff. so I mean, even if you’re looking for maybe something locally around your area, I would highly encourage you to read, read that article on our website because it really points out some of the lack of, I.

industry, enforcement, in that area. And so we’re just a company that chooses to do that ourselves because we believe in providing, a really good quality product for folks that when they’re investing in it, they’re getting exactly what they’re paying for.

And do you sell internationally? We do, yeah, we do ship internationally. and we actually have some, some good in incentives coming up as Black Friday is a, typically a really big time of year. So if anybody is looking at that,for the holidays, we will have some great promos,coming up here in the next, month or two.

[00:32:58] Tony Winyard: and something that I can’t get outta my head.

I, I lived in Amsterdam for a while and obviously they’re famous for their red light district, so it’s

[00:33:06] Wes Pfiffner: that’s true. That, and a lot of people talk about that sound, that, that song, Roxanne,where they me where they mention a lot of the red light in there.

[00:33:13] Tony Winyard: Yeah. So changing the subject Wes.

Is there, is there a book you can think of that’s really moved you for any reason?

[00:33:21] Fave books

[00:33:21] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah, there was one I’ll mention two. . and I’m actually, I’ll mention three that really changed my outlook on some things. One of ’em would be, he, Dr. Satchin Panda is his name and it’s called Circadian Codes. I’m not sure if you’ve ever heard of it, Tony, but it’s a really great book just to see that I.

how circadian works and how it affects our biology and, that timing matters. And one of, one of the analogies in that book is really cool of your stomach’s not just a dumpster to shove stuff down at, every, moment of the day. you need to train, almost train the stomach as, Hey, these are the times we eat.

You can expect that. And when your body expects it, it starts preparing. The right acids, the right enzymes to break that food down. So just different stuff like that, I, they don’t teach you that in school. I don’t know how much they teach now about circadian rhythm, but, it’s fairly new,in, in the health industry.

so that, that was a really exciting book to read. the other one was, I think it’s called Why We Sleep by Dr. Matthew Walker. It’s an incredible book. it’ll like . I don’t know. It makes you fall in love with sleep when you read it. it’s maybe one of the best books you can read about sleep. And he’s also been on several big podcasts like Joe Rogan and different stuff where he’s just a great, he’s got a great,voice of explaining stuff.

so I’m sure his audio book is good, but I really enjoyed reading his book. it was really cool to learn that much about sleep and why we sleep. And it ju it just explains it in a really simple, digestible way that’s not too complicated. . and then the last one, was really cool. it’s called Pain-Free.

and it’s a book by Pete Egoscue and it’s something I personally struggled with for several years was just, I had just chronic pain. so I had a chronic shoulder pain, chronic lower back pain. I. and I realized for myself, like it was structural problems, my body wasn’t aligned, lined right. And so what he ask you, the book calls out,is really teaching you about postural alignment.

I’d went to chiropractors. I tried tons of stuff, I tried different stretches, everything. And it wasn’t until I could actually look at my body and especially from all sides of the front of it, the side of, at the back of it, and see Hey, . you are, you’re tilted forward, and all of your upper body.

your back is like holding all of that. And so that’s where, that’s why your pain is coming as you lower back. And that’s what the shoulder, it’s like all interconnected. there’s lots of great routines you can learn,from that book. and Pete actually, I. I mentioned the San Francisco 49 ERs.

The NFL team that we work with, they actually incorporated,his method. and they have a specialist there that is, is working these players through postural alignment. so it’s pretty cool. it’s a, it’s something that I’ve adopted and I work on a daily basis. So those are three, three really cool books.

so circadian rhythm. . Sleep and then a book about posture. and it’s really cool because I feel like it goes hand in hand really with what Joovv is like just putting your body into position of how it was designed to be. It’s amazing how much that can do for your health. and light’s a big part of it.

’cause there’s months that you’re gonna go through and you, everyone knows this in the uk. there’s months you go through where the sun’s just not there. And so can you supplement with something else that can provide. You know that, that energy to your body and thankfully there is, and same with, just putting your body in the right posture of alignment.

It can function as it’s intended. ’cause when you’re in pain, it’s your body signaling to you something’s wrong. And now we’re taught so much of a pain medicine. Do this, do that, put a brace on it. But no,and that goes into me saying at the beginning of the podcast, self-discovery.

it’s gonna take you . Caring about that pain and you diving in, because if you go to a specialist or anybody, they’re just gonna listen to what you’re telling them. So the more you can learn about you, the healthier you can become.

[00:37:00] Tony Winyard: And when you talked about the, I mean, we are quite far north here, you in the Northern hemisphere, and it’s starting to get darker earlier and earlier.

And I lived in the Arctic Circle for while in the north of Norway. and for, there’s times there where it’s 23 hours of darkness during the

[00:37:17] Wes Pfiffner: So some of those Northern Scandinavian countries and Canada and so on, they, I guess they could really benefit from things like this.

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, we have a, we have an article on our site now, where we go into a little bit of that research for like seasonal effective disorder, and how near infrared is showing a lot of promise to help boosting mood, et cetera. When it comes to light, I mean, all in all, when you read, if you read any of those books that I mentioned, we are very sensitive to light.

and, our body is very sensitive to it. we react to it. in, in a very, can be positive, but also negative way. right. if you’re exposing yourself to the wrong light at night, it’s really gonna jack up your sleep. but if you expose yourself to the right type of light, especially in the morning, can really give you, it can really wake you up.

It can activate, hormones like cortisol to, to kickstart the day of what you need to feel awake. So I like to say like, when, if you can . If you could start wielding light for your benefit, I think it can have a major impact, on your health.

[00:38:15] Tony Winyard: So if people want to find out more about Joovv, where would they go,

[00:38:19] Wes Pfiffner: our website, joovv.com and if you go there,I encourage you to not go look at the products. I would go to our science page. We have a great video. I. that, that gives you just an overview on how light impacts the body, specifically red and near infrared and your cells. and then I would, I’d look at the various articles we have a ton of articles on what red and near infrared can do as far as from a benefit standpoint, how it works.

So I would just encourage you to start there. And then, the next section I would potentially go to, is the reviews. go, just go read what people are saying. how it’s impacting their life, how they’re incorporating it in, into their life, their daily routine, et cetera. And then if you’re more curious after that, definitely feel free to go look at the products.

But I just encourage you to just do more reading. don’t be a skeptic like I was where I thought this was a joke. just see what it can do. And there’s ways you can even . and start implementing better light habits in your, into your own life, even from this podcast.

Like start mitigating bright light. As soon as the sun goes down, just use, it may be low Calvin incandescent bulbs, or start using a salt lamp, or you can get some com, some red light bulbs from your local hardware store. start seeing the sun first thing in the morning, getting out regular, into the sun throughout the day.

So there’s lots of things you can do to start benefiting from . from, implementing healthy light habits, and then implementing a red light panel like Joovv takes it to the next level but there’s lots of places you can start.

[00:39:44] Tony Winyard: And can people only buy products direct from Joovv or can you, can they get ’em from say, like Amazon and so on?

[00:39:51] Wes Pfiffner: So we, yeah, we just sell directly to the consumer. joovv.com is the only place you can currently buy our products.

[00:39:59] Tony Winyard: And just before we finish, Wes, is there a quotation you can think of that really resonates with you?

[00:40:04] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah, there’s a cool quote. I can’t, I think it’s by, it might be by Les Brown. he’s a known,motivational speaker and I can’t remember the exact of it, but people will get the gist of it. That, that if you fall down and you can look up, you can get up. . And so I think that’s just a cool quote to hear because life’s very fluid and there’s ups and downs and you’re not always gonna be up.

but you’re not always gonna be down either. And the only reason you know there’s ups and downs is because you know you’re going through ’em. And if it was good all the time, nobody would know, what bad was. so yeah, if you can, if you fall down, if you can look up, you can get up.

[00:40:40] Tony Winyard: Wess, really appreciate your time and for educating us on what red light therapy is and what to look out for as well. So thank you.

[00:40:47] Wes Pfiffner: Thanks, Tony. I really enjoyed the chat.

Join me next week on The Art of Living Proactively for a fascinating glimpse into the world of Qigong. I’ll be speaking with Andrew Kenneth Fretwell, an expert Qigong and Tai Chi instructor based in Bali, to unpack the secrets of this ancient Chinese practice. Andrew will reveal how harnessing your qi or life force energy is key to living a long and vital life.

We’ll dive deep into time tested Taoist techniques like bone breathing, and special meditations that strengthen your organs and awaken your spiritual essence. You’ll learn the difference between qigong and tai chi and why starting with qigong sets you on the fast track to well being. Plus Andrew will share his insights on overcoming emotional blocks, balancing hormones and achieving enlightenment.

It’s an info packed and inspirational episode you won’t want to miss. So be sure to hit subscribe, leave us a review and share this episode with friends. Join me next week for a proactive perspective on harnessing your energy and realising your potential with Andrew Kenneth Fretwell.

Favourite Quote

"When life knocks you down, try to land on your back. Because if you can look up, you can get up. Let your reason get you back up."

Related episode:

247 – Wes Pfiffner

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Can light lead you to a lighter, brighter, more energized life. Stay tuned to find out.

This is Tony Winyard welcoming you to an illuminating episode. guaranteed to shine a light on improving your health and wellbeing. My very special guest today is Wes Pfiffner, an expert on harnessing the power of red and near infrared light. to give our bodies, an energizing boost. If you think light is only good for helping you see, think again. We’ll be delving into the science showing how red light therapy could be the missing link in your health and performance. Reducing inflammation accelerating recovery, stimulating mitochondria and more Wes will help cut through the fuzzy misconceptions Around red light and ensure you avoid any dodgy products You’ll also get practical tips on soaking up more natural sunlight and creating healthy habits at home i’m sure you’ll be dazzled And motivated to take control of light for whole body benefits Get ready to flip the switch on feeling lighter and brighter. Please do leave your enlightened comments on youtube after tuning in. Now let’s shine a light on living proactively.

[00:01:25] Tony Winyard: Welcome to The Art of Living Proactively. My guest today, Wess Ner. How you doing Wes?

[00:01:30] Wes Pfiffner: Good Tony, how are you?

[00:01:31] Tony Winyard: I’m doing well. And we’re California today.

[00:01:34] Wes Pfiffner: That’s right. That’s right. Sunny California.

[00:01:36] Tony Winyard: California love. Good to see So Wes works for a company called Joovv and they do red light therapy. Now, I know that there’s gonna be a lot of people listening.

Probably you have no idea what red light therapy is. And equally, maybe a number of people . Who they’ve heard of it, but they’re not really sure. So we are gonna dig in to find out, we’re gonna find out a lot more about what it is, and clear up all the sort of myths and so on. But let’s start off with what are your thoughts around being proactive?

[00:02:06] What Wes thinks about being proactive

[00:02:06] Wes Pfiffner: I think when I think of being proactive, I think of a lot of things of like self discovery and when we get into this topic of health, since the launch of social media, . the last decade or two we’ve really seen a lot of people gravitating towards, influencers and seeing people like what are they mixing into their routine, what works and some people being so definitive on this is the answer to health. And health’s very fluid, it’s always moving.

And so what I, how I look at health is really like self-discovery and the more things you can implement and try. The more times you’ll fail, but the more times you’ll find answers. And so I think that’s one of the best ways to be proactive with your health is try different things. Don’t stay in a rutt.

If it’s not working for you, change it. don’t keep, going on. If something’s not working, change it. Change up your routine, change up your diet. See what works for you. But ultimately. It’s about self-discovery and what works best for you. Because, and a lot of times, Tony, how you live your life and how you do your daily routine, that may not work for me.

And now we know there’s science to that, right? Some people have different circadian rhythms where they’re more awake in the morning, right? As soon as they’re out of bed, they’re ready to go. They’re, their brain is alert, like they’re ready to chomp at the bit for the day. Some people, they don’t hit that till two in the afternoon.

One in the afternoon, right? Those are more your night owls. We used to look at those people as being really lazy. They just, they don’t get enough sleep. But if you paid attention to new science that’s coming out about circadian rhythm and specifically, sleep, some people are wired to where their brain doesn’t turn on until the afternoon, And going into what works best for you and me, like there’s a lot of people that’ll say, you gotta start at 5:00 AM in the morning and do this and that. No, I’m not a believer in that. I’m a believer in . Find out what works best for you, try different things, fail and learn from it.

And I think that’s the best way You’re gonna figure out how you as a person, your body responds and how, and how you can,really thrive, in the world and for your health. So that’s how I look at being proactive is really a lot of self-discovery.

[00:04:11] Tony Winyard: Yeah, I agree completely with everything you’ve just said.

and I’m wondering, as you were speaking, how does Red Light therapy fit into to being proactive? What, well maybe explain first what it is,

[00:04:22] What is red light therapy?

[00:04:22] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah. Yeah. It’s, I’ll be the first one. If you’re listening to this for the first time and you’re hearing about red light therapy or light therapy, most likely you’ve seen it. Online,or somewhat. But, I was a super big skeptic when I first saw Red light therapy. I was like, I’ve never seen anybody talk about this before.

And this was back in, oh geez. Before the company had been started. So 2015. So nobody was talking about red light. It, the only place you would’ve seen red light would’ve been like esthetician offices. skincare stuff. there’s been a lot of science behind skincare with red light therapy.

so you would’ve seen it in that regard, maybe a face mask, but still, like most people’s knowledge of light, very little. Most people looked at it as just something that can help you see. but when, when you when you break down light, it’s energy. And most of us growing up, how we learned about light is it just helps us see.

Right? But when you actually start to look at light from a scientific perspective, it’s energy and the sun, which is our primary source. Of light and really in this universe that we live in, light is powering everything. it gives the earth heat, it, the plants and all and everything.

respond to those wavelengths of light that hit the earth and grow, provides energy. And us as humans, we really aren’t any different. a lot of people know the benefits of the sun from a vitamin D perspective, but the sun is full spectrum and it’s giving off thousands of different wavelengths.

And one of those just happens to be red and near infrared. And what those wavelengths have been shown,to do through countless, clinical studies is it actually helps, our cells function properly. And so it, it helps them produce more energy, known as ATP. And so it stimulates, an organelle in the cell called, mitochondria, which is, which helps produce, energy for the body.

And in, in a . and to button that up is red and near infrared light is specific wavelengths that your body can absorb that allows the cells to function at, at their peak and produce energy. the body can thrive. And that’s just really our makeup.

When you look at a lot of things of how we get sick, when we’re not doing well, our cells are typically struggling. and so red light therapy is a way to help support healthy cellular function.

[00:06:31] Tony Winyard: So on a bright sunny day, if someone’s, I don’t know, lying on a beach, for example, on a bright sunny day, how much red light would they be taking in, for example?

Yeah.

[00:06:41] Science behind red light

[00:06:41] Wes Pfiffner: Well, that, that’s a tough question because the sun goes through seasons, right? As the earth rotates, we get further away from the sun. And so that’s why we experienced different seasons, right? We got summer, fall, winter, spring, and during the . during the fall and winter, the sun’s further away, right?

It’s still gonna be a sunny day, it can be a sunny day in, in the fall, but the sun’s impact is much less. that’s ’cause the earth is further away. and so it’s a tough question to ask specifically, like what the time of day, ’cause there’s, there can be clouds, et cetera, but. typically at peak day, that’s when the sun’s gonna be at, its at its strongest.

And if you’ve noticed most people have during a sunrise and sunset, what colors are primarily, active from the sun? It’s red and near infrared. I. And because red is the longest color visible wavelength, that’s the only thing that’s making it through the atmosphere. That’s why you typically see like a red orangey tint or every sunrise and sunset because those other wavelengths are not reaching the surface of the earth.

[00:07:40] Tony Winyard: ’cause as well as red light therapy. Something else that many people have been talking about the last couple of years is red light saunas and so on, and, but they’re not the same thing, are they?

[00:07:48] Difference between rel light therapy and red light saunas

[00:07:48] Wes Pfiffner: no, they’re not. And they’re actually quite different. So you will see, some people will incorporate in saunas red light, like lighting above them, like a fixture. And that’s really more light to help with mood, different colors to help with mood. but saunas and a lot of people know ’em, there’s different types of saunas, but the one you’re referring to is like an infrared sauna.

Is that the same thing as red light? And they’re actually very different. When you look at infrared specifically there, there’s three types. There’s near, mid, and far and near infrared is what you typically see in, in red light panels, or red light beds, . It’s a shorter wavelength. It’s just after,red light therapy when you’re looking at the light spectrum.

And then you got mid and far infrared is a much longer wavelength and it’s got a lot of heat to it. And so what happens is those wavelengths, in a sauna far infrared, they get, they, your body absorbs them and it’s primarily affecting the water in your tissues. And so it’s almost like cooking.

You. from the inside out. So it’s designed to generate heat. And far infrared saunas actually heat your body. So you activate heat shock proteins, you start to, you start to sweat detox. Lots of benefits for far infrared. But when you’re looking at it as how are they different far, infrared provides heat and stress on the body.

And then near infrared is a minor little stress that you typically won’t even feel. and it’s generating energy. So you got red and near infrared light therapy providing energy, and then a far infrared sauna. it’s putting stress on the body to help detox, so we actually recommend a lot of people use both the therapies together and,by doing a sauna session first and then following up with a red light therapy session after, because your body’s going through a workout in a sauna.

it’s putting a lot of stress on if anybody’s actually done a good sauna session, whether it’s a . a dry sauna, a wet sauna, or far infrared sauna, you feel, you feel good after, but your body definitely went through a workout, right? And ’cause it’s try, it’s fighting to keep its core temperature stable.

That’s why you’re sweating, et cetera. so they’re great therapies to use in conjunction with one another, doing a sauna. And then we like to use, use Joovv red light therapy after.

[00:10:01] Tony Winyard: So people are probably wondering, well, how would you use that Joovv? I mean, and what is it that you would do?

Are you holding something or how does it work?

[00:10:09] Wes Pfiffner: another great question. So we, when we looked at first creating Joovv, there was a lot of, targeted devices out there. And so what I mean by targeted is people were wearing face masks, they had more handheld stuff, whether you could, to treat different areas around your body.

And when you look at the clinical data, there is a tremendous amount and for various areas around your body for treating skin. issues for,treating, joint pain and inflammation, treating wounds. now you’re seeing stuff for eyes. You’re seeing stuff for hair. You’re seeing stuff for muscle recovery.

it’s just all around the body. They’re showing where, when, where. You shine this light on the body, those cells respond really well. and so we looked at that and thought, well, no one’s really, no one’s really providing solutions to treat your entire body. And so that’s really the, the start of where Joovv developed these panels.

And so there we have red light panels that you can put in your home that can treat. sections of your body or if you’re gonna create a bigger setup can treat your entire body. and you would stand at a distance, 12 to or 16 to 24 inches away, and just expose as much skin as you can and let your body absorb that light energy.

And so that’s what kind of separated you. We were the first company to launch this panel concept. and from there it’s really taken off and a lot of people are benefiting from. Putting this healthy light, in their home and having access to it, on, on a daily basis.

[00:11:34] How long would you use it for?

[00:11:34] Tony Winyard: And so how long would you just sit in front of it or how, I mean, how long would you do that?

[00:11:40] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah. So treatments are typically 10, 10 to 20 minutes per treatment area. So let’s say I’m in front of a device that’s,we have a modular system and so you can, you can buy one panel, you, or you can connect them to another panel and . Ideally treat your entire body and,it’s 10 to 20 minutes per treatment or so you just need to expose, si similar.

How I’m sure most folks have experienced a tanning bed, right? You’d go into a tanning bed, set the timer, and just expose your skin and relax. and your body actually absorbs this light and it penetrates fairly deep into the body, especially near infrared. and that’s where you’ll see the differences of red and near infrared.

Red light is primarily absorbed by the outer tissues like your skin, and then near infrared, penetrates a little deeper and can actually stimulate, muscles, can provide healing on, on, on a deeper level. So both wavelengths are very good in conjunction with one another. And so that’s typically how a treatment is just exposing your skin and letting, letting your body absorb the light.

[00:12:37] How red lights effects inflammation

[00:12:37] Tony Winyard: So when you say, for example, it helps with inflammation, so inflammation’s quite important for the body, isn’t it?

We don’t necessarily want to stop inflammation happening. So how does it help inflammation?

[00:12:48] Wes Pfiffner: I think Tony, that’s a such a critical question because . You see that a lot, and we actually have a great article on our site that’s called Less Ice, more Light. And in fact, most people are starting to pull it back as far as the inflammation out there of using ice. and a big thing there is what does ice do?

Ice cuts off blood flow. And so when it cuts off blood flow,your body’s not able to really form that bubble. Around that injury and, because that’s essentially what an inflammation is. It’s like a, it’s like an internal bandaid. and when you cut off the blood flow, you can reduce the inflammation.

But does that accelerate the recovery because you actually want that brief acute response of a, of inflammation. and what, so what red light therapy does is part of the mechanism of action is there’s a brief . uptake in nitric oxide, released into the bloodstream. So you actually see an increase in blood flow.

So what it happens is it, so your question, does it, Inflammation, right? Is it stopping it or is it just accelerating? And it’s really just accelerating that process naturally, right? It’s getting more blood flow there more,more of, the blood, like the white blood cells, et cetera, that, that repair damaged tissues.

It’s getting more of that there. And it’s also helping those cells that are under oxidated stress in that area. let’s say an example. I went and did like a, a leg workout and I did a bunch of squats. I did a bunch of lunges. My legs are shot, right? They’re gonna, you’re gonna fill up with lactic acid, they’re gonna fill up with brief acute inflammation, red and near infrared, helps that recover just faster by healing those cells and giving those cells, shifting them from oxidative stress back to homeostasis.

And then you see a brief uptick in, in ATP. and so it just accelerates that pro na, that natural process faster.

[00:14:29] Chronic inflammation

[00:14:29] Tony Winyard: Right. And so what about then if someone has say chronic inflammation?

[00:14:36] Wes Pfiffner: That’s a good question. that’s a good question. There’s a very good meta-analysis on, the different mechanisms of red and near infrared four for inflammation. So it’s probably that’s a tough question to answer because the body is so complex and there’s many different issues of maybe why somebody’s dealing with

With chronic inflammation, right? is it arthritis? is it,is it, is it fibromyalgia? what are, is it their, is it diet related? is it some sort of a supplement they’re taking? is it a living environment, right? is it mold or is it, who knows?

what is causing that? So it’s always tough to say what it could do for chronic, but if you look at what just light does in general, it’s providing your cells, . With energy to function A as they’re designed to. So anytime you can support healthy cellular function, you’re giving your body the tools.

just like you would want to take vitamins or eat a good, healthy diet, you’re giving your body the tools. For it to run, as it wants to run. And anytime you can set yourself up for that, like what, like we’re talking about being proactive, you’re gonna, you’re gonna build a stronger body,that’s better prepared to take on, the stresses of the day or, or maybe it, maybe you’re supporting like you’re sick with something.

Or, just if I was to roll an ankle, like I’m gonna, I’m gonna deliver light to that, damaged area to give my body the tools to help prepare itself.

[00:15:52] Tony Winyard: And so as far as the actual panels, I mean you, you mentioned it’s modular and so on, and there seems to be quite a few different companies selling or, they’ve got various types of red light therapy, panels.

I guess is there much difference between ’em? I know there’s lots of stuff coming outta China, for example.

[00:16:10] What is the difference between all the red light panals?

[00:16:10] Wes Pfiffner: yeah. There is that, that really goes into any type when you see a successful . product category be developed. You always see a lot of fast followers and a lot, you’ll, you’ll see a lot of, let’s say, janky products on Amazon, right? Just it goes with the industry. I mean, if you, if anybody can remember when massage guns came onto the market, like now there’s probably a thousand of ’em on Amazon, right?

And so one, we’re the original creators of the Red Light panel per se. and so we work with a lot of individuals in the research space. and we’ve really designed our products to give the body, a safe dosage of light. You see a lot of products out there saying, oh, we deliver more power.

We’re this really, there’s no validation for that, especially with, you’ll see companies delivering multiple different wavelengths of red light, but your body responds the same to any different type of red wavelength. It’s so close that it’s not really making a significant difference.

So you see a lot of smoke and mirrors. In the red light industry with companies trying to pull a leg up. And the other part is, what separates Joovv is we actually design and develop our own products. most of what you’ll see on the market is just white labeled . products, like you mentioned, China.

they really don’t, they really don’t own those products or haven’t, designed them. They don’t really know what’s in those products. when you’re creating a product, especially here in the States, you have to follow fairly strict guidelines because it is a class two medical device. And differences with our product is the quality components are just a higher standard.

we’ve actually gone through independent safety testing, to make sure it’s safe and effective for folks at home. And so the components are just that much on a higher level. and we’re delivering a safe dosage. you wouldn’t want to just expose your body to anything out there, especially naked, not knowing if it’s been safety tested, different things like that.

So we take a lot of pride in really creating. A safe, effective device and creating and designing our own products and not just simply buying something off, Alibaba as an example because you just see that now nowadays, folks just, and some countries especially, you mentioned China, that kind of flood the market with copycat devices.

and so we do everything. We, we do everything the right way and really try to create a great product for consumers that, that can really, affect their health in a positive way.

[00:18:26] What potential dangers are there?

[00:18:26] Tony Winyard: So what could be a potential danger of someone buying, a product from somewhere? they’ve, there’s no, the manufacturer isn’t established.

Some what could be a possible danger from using a product like that?

[00:18:38] Wes Pfiffner: well, there could be many things. One, it, I mean, it could shock them. If it’s not, it, how safe it is. Has it been tested to, to go through all of that stuff. another one could be,maybe you’re delivering way too high of power to your body,in the, the photo medicines,research, there’s a known effect called the biphasic dosage response.

And it’s when you actually deliver too much light, too fast can actually cause damage to your cells. It’s almost like an overload. and so you want to make sure that dosages is safe and effective, but if you deliver too much light, for example, so there’s lots of products out there too that don’t deliver enough light.

So if you’ve ever seen something like a little flashlight, something like that’s not gonna do . Do the job. you need to make sure it’s delivering a high enough dosage to stimulate the cells, but, but not too high to where you’re gonna cause damage to the cells. So there, I mean, there’s many things, especially if you’re not like, with our products, we provide,eye protection.

our, we’ve gone through testing that are glasses. They do block that certain wavelength of light that there is a potential to, maybe overheat. the tissues in your eyes. And so there’s just many little nuances like that to where you know you’re gonna be exposing your body no different than your ti if you’re to take a supplement.

Like you’re exposing this to your body and radiating light on it. you want to make sure it’s just, it, it’s been safety tested.

[00:19:54] Tony Winyard: And so are there areas of the body you need to be more careful with then? It’s, I mean, obviously you just mentioned the eyes. Is there any other areas,

[00:20:01] Wes Pfiffner: not really. in fact, there’s been pretty cool research. we’ve participated in some small pilot studies. I. showing benefits for hormones. So like another sensitive area you would think like for a male is the testes or the private area. and actually there’s some science in animal models, but also we’ve seen it in some research we’ve participated in with an increase in testosterone.

it’s not anything that we can make like a, a strong claim about, but it just goes down to that mechanism of ranier infrared light stimulates healthy cellular function well. there’s mitochondria,in the testes, right? The late cells, there’s cells there that, that require energy, right?

To create. to create testosterone, different things of those functions. and when they receive energy, they can work properly. And so that’s what’s really fascinating about it is, what we’ve seen. There isn’t any sensitive areas. Now, if you’re delivering too high of a power down there, you , that may not be such a pleasant response.

but, but yeah, so that, that could potentially be something. But in general, . when you’re delivering a safe dosage, you can radiate the entire body.

[00:21:04] Tell me more about increasing nitric oxide

[00:21:04] Tony Winyard: And you mentioned about it increases nitric oxide. So that suggests to me, I guess it would be good for people with like asthma and respiratory issues.

[00:21:13] Wes Pfiffner: it could be. I mean, it’s, we’re always blown away with when somebody buys one of our products and they start using it, they may have bought it for X, but then all of a sudden they, they’ll leave a review or they’ll send an email and be like, Hey, I’m experiencing this type of a benefit.

is that normal? one of ’em, one of ’em, that I can think of that’s on the top of my head is . There was this gal who was doing a review of our product. I can’t remember what media outlet she wrote for, but, she has, I think it’s, where is it? Is it Bell’s Palsy where some of your face can go numb?

is that the right? I can’t remember. anybody that, that’s listening can fact check that. But there is a,an effect with, I think it’s a Bell’s Palsy that where half of your face can go, like numb. you just don’t, you don’t, you can’t feel anything.

And when she started using the red light, she was using it for skin benefits. Her Bells palsy cleared up 98% is what she, what she stated to us in an email. And she’s is that normal? Can that happen? And it’s I don’t, I mean, we don’t know, but like apparently that’s happening. And so that’s where the science is with red and ear and redline now.

It’s very fluid and it’s very evolving. most of what we’re able to say as far as a benefit is it, it can mildly reduce like pain and inflammation, relax, sore muscles, and then their skin health benefits. But it’s starting to evolve like way beyond that. and which is very exciting.

It’s a very exciting field to be in. and so we’re seeing that in the literature be proved out. There was, I know I mentioned the eyes, but there was a very exciting study. just a, just about a year and a half ago where they were using red light, not the near infrared light, red light. And it was actually help improving,vision for folks, 40 and, and over just a three minute treatment in the morning.

They were, they noted significant, benefits in improving their vision.

[00:22:49] Tony Winyard: vision

[00:22:50] Wes Pfiffner: And then one of ’em just to release this month. Very exciting study. folks that did a red light treatment after eating. it reduced blood glucose levels up to 28% versus, versus the placebo. and so that’s another one. We were scratching your head and you’re like, how could it do that?

But that kind of goes into the theme of what we’re talking about of how it just, your body takes that energy and it just starts functioning a as it’s designed to. Right. And so we don’t know the limits of it yet, which is very exciting.

[00:23:21] Is there a recommended amount of time per week?

[00:23:21] Tony Winyard: with a regular sauna. I mean, they say that if you can get accumulated 60 minutes a week, there’s like enormous benefit. So is it something similar you would need so many minutes per week, for example, or,

[00:23:34] Wes Pfiffner: great question. So typically we look at daily treatments. But most of the research that we’ve personally participated in, we saw jumps at six weeks, 12 weeks. So it’s something you need to be doing on a regular basis. It’s not a super immediate effect. Some people will see immediate, effects of maybe reducing pain in a joint because of that increase in blood flow, different things like that.

Or short-term muscle recovery. Hey, I feel a little bit less sore. After this. But I think some of those really long-term benefits, that really can improve the core of your health, it’s probably gonna be somewhere longer in, into the couple weeks. and and no different than when you’re introducing like a new supplement, maybe a multivitamin or maybe something you’re probably not gonna see.

The greatest, benefit the first time you take that supplement, but maybe when you’re looking at it over several weeks. but that’s not to say someone couldn’t see benefits right away, And because again, all of our bodies are different. Maybe we’re dealing with different stresses.

some people are super big into fitness, right? They put a lot of stress on their body. So implementing it right away like that, they could see a difference in their, in, in their recovery. So that’s something we see as an example with, a professional sports team that we’ve partnered with, the San Francisco 49 ERs.

So they’re an NFL team, right? And anybody that knows . American football, it’s a brutal sport, right? Those guys are running into each other like missiles and so they’re, it’s not uncommon for an NFL player to be like, after a game. They feel like they went through a car accident.

and so those like player, individuals like those who are putting a lot of stress on their body. they can see the benefits of it fairly quickly right after a game, and using it several days after a game, et cetera. So it depends on individual base. But from the research we’ve participated in, usually takes a couple weeks.

[00:25:17] Does time of day matter?

[00:25:17] Tony Winyard: And is there, have you noticed any difference whether. Is it better to, for example, to use it in the morning, afternoon, evening, or, I guess again, it depends on the person.

[00:25:29] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah, I mean, it depends on the person. Depends how they’re wired. we’ll, we’re split there from a customer base. Some customers, that’s part of their morning ritual, right? They get up. first thing they do is start, like a meditation routine, breathwork routine. It really helps wake them up.

It helps, give them some clarity energy throughout the day. and that’s one thing I personally do. I love to use it right in the morning. And, I’ve noticed firsthand, I. I know everyone can probably relate to this that time where you wake up some of those mornings and you just feel that brain fog.

It’s like you just woke up out of a deep sleep. Maybe suddenly maybe your alarm went off or something like that, and you just feel lethargic, right? for whatever reason, I, right after a treatment I do in the morning, that’s gone, like I just don’t experience that brain fog in the morning or that,that, that haziness that can be there.

and so a lot of people, like in the morning, me personally. but then there’s a large group that they like doing it at night. It really helps relax them. most likely shifts them into,like a parasympathetic state. And a lot of people will just rave about how they get great sleep,when they start using it at night before bed as a wind down tool, et cetera.

So it’s split there. And there’s also . A cool feature on our products that you can use through our app we call ambient mode. And it’s not delivering a, like a clinical dosage, it’s just delivering red ambient lighting. And so a lot of people will turn that setting on. ’cause at night, red is not very intrusive on your circadian rhythm, so it really doesn’t halt melatonin production.

and so it’s a great wind down tool to maybe put on in the bedroom, right? Maybe you’re gonna read a book or you’re gonna, you’re gonna do something as a wind down routine. Turn off all the blue light. it can be a great way to help and do sleep just from that ambient lighting perspective.

split there and really,depends on, what works best for you.

[00:27:12] Would it work well with meditation?

[00:27:12] Tony Winyard: And it sounds, well something that went through my mind as you were saying that it sounds like something that would be great to pair it together with say meditation, doing it at the same time as you meditate.

[00:27:23] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah. We see that a lot. We see a lot of people starting their day with that or their nighttime routine with that of breath work and meditation. Just, I think we live in such a world now that we’re so overstimulated. and if you think about us as humans right now, we’ve never had more information than any other humans on earth.

And we’ve never had it that fast. I mean, you can learn something with an instant and your brain can be constantly bouncing. I mean, how many of us, I’m sure . I’m gonna raise my hand. How many of us have, they maybe stumble across something, they’ve been scrolling and then they’re off learning about that, and then they’re clicking here, and then they’re doing, and it’s boom.

but think about your brain. It’s going, it’s like bouncing like boom. And that stimulation, right? And it can be very hard to turn that off and then go to bed. and so I think. When you’re, when we’re talking about something that can help relax you, calm you.

I think that’s a big thing in our day and age. you look at, you look at just the average, and this is the states, so I imagine it’s probably the same in the uk, but, a hundred years ago the average American slept about nine and a half hours. and now, we’re under six, the average American.

So that’s just significantly different in a hundred year span. We’re sleeping,over two hours less a night. and just that alone, like getting a good night’s sleep versus not getting a good night’s sleep. Like you’re not gonna, function the next day. yeah, I think, back to your question of it’s if IFD really good to pair it with things that can calm you, not stimulating, relaxing, so definitely great to pair with breath work or meditation.

[00:28:53] Hormesis

[00:28:53] Tony Winyard: Early on, you talked about how it. Stimulates production of mitochondria and ATP and everything.

And I wondered, something went through my mind as you were saying that does it, when you do hormesis and cold showers and saunas and so on, you are accumulating, you are building up more brown fat. Does this have anything to do with that whole sort of process?

[00:29:17] Wes Pfiffner: I, there you’ll see some folks promoting a lot of I know you’re not specifically talking about fat loss, but . There are some people that are promoting like high powered lasers of almost stimulating fat loss or burning fat loss, not really with our products.

You’re gonna, you’re gonna see that. Now, I will put a caveat in there that, and something we’ve seen through a research partner of ours and the study hasn’t been published yet, but, it helped assist. In, in, in someone, trying to, lose weight, with exercise and diet. Because if we, if you,if you go back to that study that I mentioned about blood glucose and how it lowered at 28%.

So if it has the ability to help your metabolic system, and that function better, it could help support, weight loss, different things. So it’s tough to put like a, an actual . yes or no on, on some of the stuff with like fat burning, et cetera. because it’s just so overall supporting with your body in nearly every function.

And that’s why we really encourage full body, to help try to get that systemic benefits.

[00:30:18] Myths about red light therapy

[00:30:18] Tony Winyard: are there any myths about red light therapy that you’d like to quash?

[00:30:24] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah, I’d say one of the bigger myths out there is it like, is it snake oil? and no,it’s definitely not. I mean, there’s a lot of scientific IT literature now. I mean, you can go to PubMed right now and just type in red light therapy, just type in the year 2023, you’re gonna see hundreds of studies.

it, it’s, so from that standpoint, like it’s really, it’s pretty solidified, that it, there is lots and lots of benefits to it. wavelengths do matter. the other thing I would probably say is it’s,you can’t get these benefits from, draping yourself in red Christmas lights.

It’s just, there’s not gonna be a high enough power, so power matters. and the science is legitimate when you’re looking at what this therapy can do for folks.

[00:31:04] Tony Winyard: And so when, if people are considering buying these products, I mean, obviously they should get Joovv products, but if they’re looking for things, what should they look out for?

What should they be looking to avoid?

[00:31:18] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah,I would avoid a couple things. I would really avoid,companies promoting,like when they promote, let’s say medical claims. ’cause a lot of companies, they’re trying to follow our route of being a legitimate medical product and simply stating it doesn’t mean you’re a medical product.

So I would always look at the company to show validation for that. So one, one tricky thing we’ve seen in the industry is folks saying, Hey, we’ve been through, safety testing and medical testing. But then when you ask, and they’ll show like a safety mark. But if you look up that safety mark, it’ll show it’s safe for horticulture use.

So like plant use, it’s a grow, like a grow light. So it’s very tricky. which is why we’re pretty transparent with all of that. we have,lots of articles on our website of things to really look out for and we, I believe it’s called, misleading Marketing Claims in the red light therapy industry.

And we call a lot of that out with power. Wavelengths, safety testing, misleading marks, all of that sort of stuff. so I mean, even if you’re looking for maybe something locally around your area, I would highly encourage you to read, read that article on our website because it really points out some of the lack of, I.

industry, enforcement, in that area. And so we’re just a company that chooses to do that ourselves because we believe in providing, a really good quality product for folks that when they’re investing in it, they’re getting exactly what they’re paying for.

And do you sell internationally? We do, yeah, we do ship internationally. and we actually have some, some good in incentives coming up as Black Friday is a, typically a really big time of year. So if anybody is looking at that,for the holidays, we will have some great promos,coming up here in the next, month or two.

[00:32:58] Tony Winyard: and something that I can’t get outta my head.

I, I lived in Amsterdam for a while and obviously they’re famous for their red light district, so it’s

[00:33:06] Wes Pfiffner: that’s true. That, and a lot of people talk about that sound, that, that song, Roxanne,where they me where they mention a lot of the red light in there.

[00:33:13] Tony Winyard: Yeah. So changing the subject Wes.

Is there, is there a book you can think of that’s really moved you for any reason?

[00:33:21] Fave books

[00:33:21] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah, there was one I’ll mention two. . and I’m actually, I’ll mention three that really changed my outlook on some things. One of ’em would be, he, Dr. Satchin Panda is his name and it’s called Circadian Codes. I’m not sure if you’ve ever heard of it, Tony, but it’s a really great book just to see that I.

how circadian works and how it affects our biology and, that timing matters. And one of, one of the analogies in that book is really cool of your stomach’s not just a dumpster to shove stuff down at, every, moment of the day. you need to train, almost train the stomach as, Hey, these are the times we eat.

You can expect that. And when your body expects it, it starts preparing. The right acids, the right enzymes to break that food down. So just different stuff like that, I, they don’t teach you that in school. I don’t know how much they teach now about circadian rhythm, but, it’s fairly new,in, in the health industry.

so that, that was a really exciting book to read. the other one was, I think it’s called Why We Sleep by Dr. Matthew Walker. It’s an incredible book. it’ll like . I don’t know. It makes you fall in love with sleep when you read it. it’s maybe one of the best books you can read about sleep. And he’s also been on several big podcasts like Joe Rogan and different stuff where he’s just a great, he’s got a great,voice of explaining stuff.

so I’m sure his audio book is good, but I really enjoyed reading his book. it was really cool to learn that much about sleep and why we sleep. And it ju it just explains it in a really simple, digestible way that’s not too complicated. . and then the last one, was really cool. it’s called Pain-Free.

and it’s a book by Pete Egoscue and it’s something I personally struggled with for several years was just, I had just chronic pain. so I had a chronic shoulder pain, chronic lower back pain. I. and I realized for myself, like it was structural problems, my body wasn’t aligned, lined right. And so what he ask you, the book calls out,is really teaching you about postural alignment.

I’d went to chiropractors. I tried tons of stuff, I tried different stretches, everything. And it wasn’t until I could actually look at my body and especially from all sides of the front of it, the side of, at the back of it, and see Hey, . you are, you’re tilted forward, and all of your upper body.

your back is like holding all of that. And so that’s where, that’s why your pain is coming as you lower back. And that’s what the shoulder, it’s like all interconnected. there’s lots of great routines you can learn,from that book. and Pete actually, I. I mentioned the San Francisco 49 ERs.

The NFL team that we work with, they actually incorporated,his method. and they have a specialist there that is, is working these players through postural alignment. so it’s pretty cool. it’s a, it’s something that I’ve adopted and I work on a daily basis. So those are three, three really cool books.

so circadian rhythm. . Sleep and then a book about posture. and it’s really cool because I feel like it goes hand in hand really with what Joovv is like just putting your body into position of how it was designed to be. It’s amazing how much that can do for your health. and light’s a big part of it.

’cause there’s months that you’re gonna go through and you, everyone knows this in the uk. there’s months you go through where the sun’s just not there. And so can you supplement with something else that can provide. You know that, that energy to your body and thankfully there is, and same with, just putting your body in the right posture of alignment.

It can function as it’s intended. ’cause when you’re in pain, it’s your body signaling to you something’s wrong. And now we’re taught so much of a pain medicine. Do this, do that, put a brace on it. But no,and that goes into me saying at the beginning of the podcast, self-discovery.

it’s gonna take you . Caring about that pain and you diving in, because if you go to a specialist or anybody, they’re just gonna listen to what you’re telling them. So the more you can learn about you, the healthier you can become.

[00:37:00] Tony Winyard: And when you talked about the, I mean, we are quite far north here, you in the Northern hemisphere, and it’s starting to get darker earlier and earlier.

And I lived in the Arctic Circle for while in the north of Norway. and for, there’s times there where it’s 23 hours of darkness during the

[00:37:17] Wes Pfiffner: So some of those Northern Scandinavian countries and Canada and so on, they, I guess they could really benefit from things like this.

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, we have a, we have an article on our site now, where we go into a little bit of that research for like seasonal effective disorder, and how near infrared is showing a lot of promise to help boosting mood, et cetera. When it comes to light, I mean, all in all, when you read, if you read any of those books that I mentioned, we are very sensitive to light.

and, our body is very sensitive to it. we react to it. in, in a very, can be positive, but also negative way. right. if you’re exposing yourself to the wrong light at night, it’s really gonna jack up your sleep. but if you expose yourself to the right type of light, especially in the morning, can really give you, it can really wake you up.

It can activate, hormones like cortisol to, to kickstart the day of what you need to feel awake. So I like to say like, when, if you can . If you could start wielding light for your benefit, I think it can have a major impact, on your health.

[00:38:15] Tony Winyard: So if people want to find out more about Joovv, where would they go,

[00:38:19] Wes Pfiffner: our website, joovv.com and if you go there,I encourage you to not go look at the products. I would go to our science page. We have a great video. I. that, that gives you just an overview on how light impacts the body, specifically red and near infrared and your cells. and then I would, I’d look at the various articles we have a ton of articles on what red and near infrared can do as far as from a benefit standpoint, how it works.

So I would just encourage you to start there. And then, the next section I would potentially go to, is the reviews. go, just go read what people are saying. how it’s impacting their life, how they’re incorporating it in, into their life, their daily routine, et cetera. And then if you’re more curious after that, definitely feel free to go look at the products.

But I just encourage you to just do more reading. don’t be a skeptic like I was where I thought this was a joke. just see what it can do. And there’s ways you can even . and start implementing better light habits in your, into your own life, even from this podcast.

Like start mitigating bright light. As soon as the sun goes down, just use, it may be low Calvin incandescent bulbs, or start using a salt lamp, or you can get some com, some red light bulbs from your local hardware store. start seeing the sun first thing in the morning, getting out regular, into the sun throughout the day.

So there’s lots of things you can do to start benefiting from . from, implementing healthy light habits, and then implementing a red light panel like Joovv takes it to the next level but there’s lots of places you can start.

[00:39:44] Tony Winyard: And can people only buy products direct from Joovv or can you, can they get ’em from say, like Amazon and so on?

[00:39:51] Wes Pfiffner: So we, yeah, we just sell directly to the consumer. joovv.com is the only place you can currently buy our products.

[00:39:59] Tony Winyard: And just before we finish, Wes, is there a quotation you can think of that really resonates with you?

[00:40:04] Wes Pfiffner: Yeah, there’s a cool quote. I can’t, I think it’s by, it might be by Les Brown. he’s a known,motivational speaker and I can’t remember the exact of it, but people will get the gist of it. That, that if you fall down and you can look up, you can get up. . And so I think that’s just a cool quote to hear because life’s very fluid and there’s ups and downs and you’re not always gonna be up.

but you’re not always gonna be down either. And the only reason you know there’s ups and downs is because you know you’re going through ’em. And if it was good all the time, nobody would know, what bad was. so yeah, if you can, if you fall down, if you can look up, you can get up.

[00:40:40] Tony Winyard: Wess, really appreciate your time and for educating us on what red light therapy is and what to look out for as well. So thank you.

[00:40:47] Wes Pfiffner: Thanks, Tony. I really enjoyed the chat.

Join me next week on The Art of Living Proactively for a fascinating glimpse into the world of Qigong. I’ll be speaking with Andrew Kenneth Fretwell, an expert Qigong and Tai Chi instructor based in Bali, to unpack the secrets of this ancient Chinese practice. Andrew will reveal how harnessing your qi or life force energy is key to living a long and vital life.

We’ll dive deep into time tested Taoist techniques like bone breathing, and special meditations that strengthen your organs and awaken your spiritual essence. You’ll learn the difference between qigong and tai chi and why starting with qigong sets you on the fast track to well being. Plus Andrew will share his insights on overcoming emotional blocks, balancing hormones and achieving enlightenment.

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